In popular language (movies, books, regular conversation), we always hear about sex as something the woman gives to the man. It is always talked about as something the woman gives and the man receives.
This seems a bit weird. If an impartial observer looked at most sex acts (with the rare exception of blowjobs and the girl riding the man), he would probably say that it was the man giving (as in doing most of the work, trying to pleasure the other) and the woman receiving. Even in a strictly physical sense, the act usually ends with the man giving the girl his seed.
It also seems very cultural. I remember from anthropology reading about the Cayapa in the Andes, where the way they talk about sex is literally “the vagina eating the penis”, and it is mostly seen as something women do to men.
The way we talk about it in our culture seems to reflect an underlying assumption that women don’t really like sex that much, so that when they do have it, it is more to be seen as something they do to please their partner, and as such it is something they give to him (even if it is really composed of him trying to please her).
This seems like a really unhealthy pattern that could be influencing a lot of women into thinking that they shouldn’t really like sex. I wonder how we ended up like that and what society would be like if we instead thought of sex as something the man gives to the woman?
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It boils down to the pregnancy-risk. By “giving sex” it really means the woman is choosing to risk pregnancy with that particular man.
Men don’t really have anything to “lose” so to speak when it comes to sex, but women can end up having to invest 9 months, give birth, bodily changes etc.
100’s of years of systemic sexism. In a society with readily available contraception and equal rights this attitude would naturally decay.
I agree entirely. I think it’s very unhealthy to think of sex as something women “have” and that men “want,” and so women will then distribute sex as they see fit. I’m afraid that such a view too closely identifies women with their sexuality and leaves behind the entire person. It always make sex just some sort of transaction, rather two people mutually enjoying one another. It’s also not such a healthy view of male sexuality, either, imho, but I’ll let some others sort that one out…
Look man, as a man it is just the fact that women decide who they will have sex with. It works like that in all animals I know.
Just because some are not happy about it doesnt change the fact that women are in control in this aspect.
The reason we talk about it is because men (traditionally) have the higher sex drive and the more frequent desire to do it.
In any situation, when someone wants something the other person has (or wants to convince the other person to do) the power is COMPLETELY with that of the other person. Standard negotiation rules.
People underestimate the importance of culture. Historically, both in literature and art, it’s the girl who concede herself – even if in the past marriages were arranged. This of course goes with the man having to court or even conquer the girl – a manner typical of Greek, Latin and of course medieval literature. In the end, this is the other face of sexism: you have to cover it up with a noble story.
That’s funny, because I’ve always seen it portrayed as something done *to* women. My willingness to *give* it was ultimately a turn off to (misogynistic) men.
Cause we are still unpacking patriarchy where women are seen as merely bearers of children and men are seen as little more than sexual beasts who are also somehow more capable of being in charge?
Never really thought about that. My adhd brain is really going to think about it next time I tell my husband to give it to me lol
Also tbh there is not a lot of mutuality in sex …
See the orgasm gap. A lot of women are enduring not enjoying
( I secretly think a lot of men are also enduring but their enduring looks a lot more like using women as masturbation tools)
Because patriarchy
Wow I’ve been asking that same question for years. The most common answers are
*Most porn is made for men.
*It’s more appealing and sexier to watch a woman doing it.
*Women like doing it.
So what is the real answer. Truthfully “I don’t think there is 1 right answer.
For some reason I’ve always thought about the man doing the fing and the woman being fd. I think it’s because in heterosexual sex women are penetrated.
Because the language was there before woman had any rights or laws
It’s a good question but it also reflects the current reality. On average, receiving sex from a woman as a man is way more difficult than for a woman to receive sex from a man.
Just imagine if an average man onto a busy street holding a sign “I want someone to have sex with”. People would laugh and walk past. But if an average woman did the same, some man would probably take up on the offer within 2 minutes.
The “man doing the work” is not usually to bring pleasure to her, it is bringing pleasure to himself. That is why there is the trope of “women don’t enjoy sex” because far too often men don’t care about women’s pleasure or don’t know how to please a woman. When women are not getting pleasure from sex, they don’t enjoy it!
For a long time people didn’t even think women enjoyed sex. It was a wifely duty. So I think that is why people think it’s something women do for men. I think that should change. Women should prioritize getting pleasure from sex too.
As a woman, I definitely feel like the receiver and have never seen myself as giving it to someone when I’m in the act.
But then how do lesbians get a sex??
I see this mentality and language in a lot of the questions posted in this subreddit? “How do I tell my GF I don’t like her blowjobs?” Or “How do I tell my boyfriend I don’t enjoy the way he goes down on me?”
You communicate – because you are BOTH involved in the activity. Instead people adopt these passive/receiver type roles and seem to think they are just passengers in sexual experiences. You should both be taking turns driving, and if you aren’t driving then you should be navigating. It takes two!
Misogyny.
It’s easier to place men as poor victims of lust when they have no control over sex.
>he would probably say that it was the man giving (as in doing most of the work, trying to pleasure the other)
🤣🤣🤣🤣 orgasm gap shows men generally aren’t trying to give pleasure to women. Oral sex for women is less than a quarter of how much oral sex men get. All that thrusting and movement is for his orgasm not hers or theirs as clitoral stimulation is generally how most women orgasm. A guy doing more movement isn’t evident of him trying to please her or doing most of the work.
Based on anecdotal evidence I seem to read online, there doesn’t seem to be much reciprocity. The women are just giving bjs, giving foreplay, etc, while the men are just jack hammering away, caring nothing for their partners’ pleasure. That’s why even though women are on the receiving end literally, figuratively, they are the givers, the men the takers (not for all instances obviously).
I think it’s for a few reasons.
It’s much easier for a man to have enjoyable sex (ie very easy to please) while women often don’t enjoy sex unless it’s done in a particular way. I also think women are much more picky about partners. They may only enjoy sex with particular partners. Most men will enjoy having sex with just about anyone (although they may not want others to know about it.)
So I don’t deny women enjoy sex and can have a very strong sex drive (my girlfriend’s is often stronger than mine) but it’s a bit more dependent on situation. Men are generally indiscriminate. And most men have an extreme sex drive during adolescence and as young adults. I consider myself reasonably enlightened on such matters but I still don’t think the average woman has a sex drive as high as the average man. Just in the “want to fuck anything with a pulse” sort of way. It’s hard to get across just how horny young men are. Fucking animals.
The top comment about pregnancy risk is a good point too. Women have more to lose in a random sexual encounter.
>If an impartial observer looked at most sex acts (with the rare exception of blowjobs and the girl riding the man), he would probably say that it was the man giving (as in doing most of the work, trying to pleasure the other) and the woman receiving. Even in a strictly physical sense, the act usually ends with the man giving the girl his seed.
>
Not when it’s sex with me, baby. They don’t call me the starfish for nothing!
In seriousness I absolutely agree. When I was a stupid teenager I was so taken by the narrative of women “giving up” sex to men than I genuinely didn’t realize that women actually enjoyed sex as an act of itself. It’s a super bizarre and I think somewhat damaging way of framing sex, that has somehow become the default.
Because it’s assumed that the men will want it. And that women don’t but do so to please their partners.
It’s changing slowly but a lot of people still feel that way.
Because for hundreds of years that’s how women were seen. Asexual and in subservience to men. I grew up in the 80s and was outright told by my mother that sex is horrible and only pleasurable for men 🙄
It gets talked about the other way too. It just doesn’t get talked about enough as something shared.
I think because men have cocks which are viewed as “active” while women are viewed as “passive” because our sex organs are internal
The reason for that is the fact that most women when they want sex they don’t need to look that much for it (mostly just say yes and they can have sex). Most men need to put some effort to achieve that goal, ones more than others ( and I’m still not considering incels).
Edit: Besides that, we still have to consider that only a person with a uterus can bare a child. That’s is the reason behind men’s doing more dangerous work then woman’s ( historically speaking).
From a society point of view, men’s are more disposable than woman’s.
It’s related to interest in sex, and interest in looks. Not all, but many women are less interested in sex than men are, and see it as a necessity to get into a relationship. Secondly, many men see most women as beautiful, while many women aren’t attracted to most guys.
Because without the women it’s just us men having a wank, and how often does a women want it and a man say no
You cannot like it as much as you want but it’s still the truth.
Because men beg for sex and women don’t. It’s culturally a 1 way street
I agree with you. I was talking to a buddy the other day and somehow it came up that I had turned my wife down when she propositioned me for sex the night before. It blew his mind, he was like wait you can turn down a woman?
Because my wife just lays there for 2 minutes and RECEIVES the lovin’ I GIVE her!!!
Isn’t it that way for everyone ?! /s
In short, patriarchy. For a very long time sex was seen as a wife’s duty to her husband. That the marital contract entitled a man to sex and this was the justification used for exempting martial rape from rape laws. There is also this framing of male sexuality that persists wherein men are helplessly horny and unaccountable for their sexual actions. It’s the “he just couldn’t help himself” attitude that’s also been used to justify rape.
By ignoring a man’s responsibility in heterosexual sex, you’re also removing his agency- thus women are perceived to be in control of sex. On the flip side, assuming that a man automatically and always consents to any sexual encounter is the reason male victims of rape are dismissed. It’s not an empowering framing for anyone.
Speaking just of sex as an act- not addressing the offspring/pregnancy aspect…
There are more men wanting sex than there are women wanting sex. Yes, you can factor in women being more choosy about who they have sex with which adds to the issue. Generally speaking men have to do more work/social maneuvering in order to get the opportunity to have sex. Even for those that purchase sex, it is a social commodity/exchange where guys are earning, trading, purchasing the opportunity to “have” sex, to own/rent it in even in a temporary sense.
To be clear I don’t think all women are selling themselves, I do think women have the right to sell themselves, I don’t think men can/should own women.
It seems like something that has its roots in evolutionary psychology. The woman is the one burdened with pregnancy so she must be choosy in selecting a mate, while it is the job of men to procreate as much as possible to ensure the species survives. This would result in a situation where sex/reproduction is determined by the woman who chooses who to mate with, and has evolved into something that women “give” (by choosing a mate) and men “receive” (by being the fortunate chosen one).
It’s mainly to do with stereotypes that are toxic to both men and women:
That women aren’t equal in the exchange and that it’s a negative when women say no.
That men are always horny and only want sex and that men’s consent means less.
It’s a prevalent example of toxic masculinity in the modern day.
It’s such a faulty assumption. I also can say that almost every past partner I’ve had, has made me feel ashamed sexually in some way. For a long time, I felt dirty, and like I was the problem. So for me personally, that was why I felt like I shouldn’t be enjoying sex as much. I couldn’t be my full sexual self, without being made to feel like I was “gross” somehow. So, I hid it. I hid to from my exes and ex husband until I couldn’t anymore.
Somewhere along the line I read an article (on Medium I think, written by a hetero man) where he literally was telling women to stop feeling like they are the ones being fucked. I remember him writing something like, “ladies, YOU are fucking THEM.” Kind of like a call to action to take back our power. It kind of planted a seed so to say.
I look at sex differently now. It’s only finally now with my current partner, that I truly feel like we are fucking each other, which is kind of strange to say.
I also read something about the “vagina eating the penis”, and my sex therapist has even referenced that phrase.
On top of that, I’m very much an advocate for adult play – whatever that may look like to us. We don’t play enough, we don’t nurture that inner child. Sex can be seen as play for adults – a way to connect and communicate with each other in an intimate way.
TL;DR My (F) view of sex got skewed by men along the way, even though it started off healthy. I had to relearn and change my entire view about sex as a female, but couldn’t do that until I had a partner who was fully accepting of my sexuality and didn’t shame it.
It’s probably because woman in former times had headage all the time
Cause men are always begging for it and women are always reluctantly giving in… atleast that’s how society will tell you it happens.
Possibly how guys are mainly expected to romance the girl and “receives sex” as a reward which the woman had to give to him
I think the phrasing of this is kind of “off”. It’s not something that girls “give” but they do however give permission.
Evolutionarily speaking, women are the guardians of the eggs. They decide whose genes get to reproduce. So it’s not so much as something that’s “given” (unless it’s a specific sex act like oral) but it’s really permission that’s given.
I think it has to do with what comes before the actual activity that sex is, meaning the flirting, the lead up or whatever else you might call it. I think I can make the generalisation that in most cases, if a woman offered a man to give him a handjob, blowjob or just sex itself, the man would see it as a gift, as his lucky day and gladly accept. However if a man offered the same deal to a woman, she would decline without knowing him better.
So I don’t think the whole “sex is something the woman gives to the man” should be understood in terms of the activity where women “do” sexy to/with a man, but more the fact that the woman “allows” (gives) the man sex.
For me it tracks back to evolution. Because men tried to spread their seed, so they want to have sex with as many women as they could. Whereas women also have to give birth which is why they search and decide for the best they can have. This translates to: women are holding the key to sex. Generally a man will have sex with almost every woman, but a woman would only choose the best of the available men. So the woman has a more narrow selection. Thats why woman can decide who has sex and therefore a woman gives sex. Is it good? No. But I think it will take a lot to change that mentality, especially bc you cant change biology (at least at the moment)