I know why from historical context. War of ideologies etc.
But I for example learned that the concept itself is a very good thing, that only the Implementation and outcome of such systems were really bad and social concepts can help countries to improve well beeing for many citicens and as a result in a more stable society. Less poverty -> less crime etc.
But These problems doesn’t make the concept of solidarity itself bad for a society?
Genuine question here.
I often get the: Each fights for themselves from americans. Why ist that. Or is this not really how people think and I only get a distorted picture through Media?
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I think you have a distorted and exaggerated understanding of our views on communism and “solidarity”.
I think there might be a translation error.
Communism the political theory is generally frowned upon.
Communal living in the sense of working with one’s neighbors and the need of many people to accomplish goals is not.
That being said, compared to some other nation the US has a greater affinity for supporting independent action and self reliance. Some people think this is because our society is not that far removed (relatively speaking) from our expansionist era where people were forced to be very self reliant.
Because communism and solidarity aren’t the same thing. Solidarity is mutual support through agreement based on the choice of the stakeholders. Communism is a socioeconomic theory where the workers seize the means of production and resources. One is giving and one is taking. We largely don’t support communism because its a flawed ideology that ends up harming its practitioners in the long run. We support and engage in solidarity regularly when the need arises.
We don’t fight only for ourselves we are amazingly charitable. But there is an expectation in the US that you atleast attempt to provide for yourself. What is frowned upon is having sacrifice personal/family resources for other people’s poor decision making.
> But I for example learned that the concept itself is a very good thing
Please elaborate, and maybe an actual debate will develop.
If the implementation is always bad, one should consider that the idea itself has flaws that results in the bad implementation.
Distorted picture from the media? I’ve been to too many museums to think that communism is anything but an evil ideology that’s one of the worst things to happen to the world in the last century.
If you every get the chance to travel the world, it’s hard to like communism after visiting the killing fields of Cambodia, the Korean DMZ, the Stasi museum, a KGB prison, the museum of Terror and a memorial to the victims of communism. Each in a different country that’s suffered under communism and its not even all of them.
We learned the lesson after a few hundred million, if not more, were liquidated.
I’m not speaking for everyone else. I’m going to tell you how I was raised.
Communism is a great idea for people who think the escaped history. Societies who buy into humanism as their core drive have given into decadence and are bound to reckon with this action for the rest of their existence. Existence and life are brutal, the more you centralize any system, the more vulnerable you make it to any malicious force.
-my grandpa’s take
Social nature is built around trust. You trust who you know and you trust yourself. Communism or collectivism works well at this localized scale. It is easier to trust people you have more in common with. This doesn’t scale well in a nation of 300 million people of different ethnic and cultural backgrounds. Especially when 57% of African Americans live in the South, surrounded by people whose great great grandparents own their great great grandparents. This has improved but it’s still not great.
-my dad’s take
The South has a grudge against the Northeast (and vice versa). The Plains/Rocky Mountains pick fights with Cascadia. The Midwest gets to pick the winner of almost every fight. I don’t think we’re United enough to do collectivist ideologies. Every social program has to deal with economic interests of a very diverse country and if it isn’t outright killed it has to be corrupted in a million different ways to make it amicable for a few influential groups.
-My take
I wasn’t taught that communism itself is a bad thing. But we did cover things related to the USSR, the Cultural Revolution in China, and stuff like that. Which were done by people who proclaimed to be following Communism.
In general, our K-12education system tries not to take firm stances on personal, political decisions. I couldn’t tell you the politics of any of my history or government teachers in high school (and this was at a Catholic school).
College, instructors and professors get more leeway.
Communal living or simply functioning as a society is not communism.
The Red Scare, Cold War, and neoliberalism did a number on the American psyche. Speaking as a self-professed communist, there are reasons to be critical of any ideology or economic system. That being said, there was a concerted effort by the movers and shakers of American culture to portray anything left-adjacent as the devil incarnate; given who we were up against in the Cold War. U.S efforts like COINTELPRO and cooperation with big business made it extremely difficult, if not deadly, for people to organize. Take a look at things like the Battle of Blair Mountain or the assassination of Fred Hampton for some of the many examples.
It wasn’t always like this though, America has always had a socialist undercurrent in some form or another from the IWW to the Black Panthers. The reason why you see more young people calling themselves socialists or communists these days is because in addition to the economic clusterfuck we’re in, there’s less exposure to Red Scare propaganda.
We don’t have social security and other things because we think think all solidarity is bad. I think you’re just confused.
My general sense is that cultural attitudes are changing as Americans become increasingly disillusioned by the neoliberal promise. Support for things like labor unions and universal healthcare has grown a lot in recent years. But the belief for a very long time, especially among conservatives, was that collective bargaining and all forms of government assistance, income redistribution and social welfare equal socialism, which still holds intense social stigma.
It’s basically “literally no one deserves any help for any reason at any time.” And yes, it’s incredibly oppressive.
ETA: to answer your question, the reason this ideology is perpetuated is because it benefits the wealthy.
Well, to start with many people aren’t convinced that Communism will lead to less poverty. Most of the public perception of Communism is shaped by the USSR which was famous for how impoverished people were. People aren’t sold on the idea that it was just a problem of implementation and instead are convinced that the concept itself is flawed and that other economic approaches are better for driving a greater total wealth for the nation. It’s also become heavily associated with Totalitarianism because many Americans see that as the only possible way to implement Communism. As a result, any ideas derived from Socialism and Communism (synonyms to many Americans) must be rebranded to something else to even think about selling the ideas to the general American public.
But, from a broader standpoint, the US has [the most individualistic culture](https://clearlycultural.com/geert-hofstede-cultural-dimensions/individualism/) on the planet. To put it simply, in the US there is a great deal of pride to be derived from being able to support yourself. There are many people who see it as a fundamental right to succeed or fail by their own merits and that having that taken away undermines their sense of self. While taking it to the extreme isn’t universal, there are some people who find the idea of relying on community support so insulting that they would rather stay impoverished than take such support. It’s hard to sell the idea of Communism to a society that has this degree of individualism hardwired into the society. There would need to be a massive cultural shift to make Communism (even rebranded) seem viable. Without such a cultural shift, I would expect the US to be the last country on the planet to adopt Communism.
You’ve already received plenty of great responses, but I would add that you really need to look at this not as a dichotomy between total communism vs. radical individualism, but as a continuum between the two.
Believing in individualism doesn’t mean you oppose anything and everything communal. Public services, such as fire and police could be called “communal,” for example.
I think Communism should be thought of with as much disdain if not more than fascism.