I have been dating this guy for a bit over two months, I really adore him and see a future together. We have been seeing each other almost every day, spending the nights together, and we text and call all the time. So about a week ago I sat down with him and had “the talk”. I told him I have feelings for him and would like give a long-term relationship a try, and asked if he felt the same. Given his behavior for the past months I was pretty confident this was going to be a nice, romantic conversation.
He responded by literally saying: “Define feelings..?” and explaining he “does not like labels or this whole boyfriend-girlfriend-thing”. I was very surprised and hurt (and felt a bit humiliated), but said I that I understood and respected it. After that he just went on like nothing had happened, and seemed genuinely confused when I left to sleep at home that night.
I took a week to think about things. I really like him, but I don’t like the idea of investing all my time and love in someone that does not feel the same way. So, when I met him yesterday I told him that I wanted to change things. We can still see each other, be friends, and maybe even do cozy or sexy stuff if ever in the mood, but that I would like to have some space to get over my romantic feelings, plus maybe go on some other dates and explore the waters.
He got really upset, saying that I was manipulative and toxic, trying to “force” him to call me his girlfriend or I would go sleep with others. He also said that I was pushy for wanting a definition of the relationship this early in. This made me feel really bad, and I am now questioning my decisions. Maybe part of me wanted to see his reaction when I told him I wanted to go on other dates, not to “force him” to be with me (I wouldn’t want that anyway, if I know he does not want it), but to show him that I am not just a silly girl completely in love with him and that I do have options. Maybe that was super toxic. But at the same time, I am just being honest. I don’t want to be in a one-sided relationship. Gah, I don’t know. I need an outside perspective.
Edit: He told me has never been in a relationship before and that is why the “labels” scare him. He says he does not want any of us to date other people. This guy does not have a f\*ck-boy vibe, but rather a socially-awkward “unable to talk to women” kind of vibe. And that somehow makes me even more confused…
Edit 2: Thank you so much for great responses. I am feeling very validated. I guess I worry so much about being “the drama”. But now I realize that HE is “the drama”. I just want enough answers from him so that we can chill drama free, and he does not offer that – hence drama.
40 comments
“I’ve thought about it and I disagree with you. It’s not selfish to seek a relationship elsewhere if you’re not interested. You’re not my partner so my romantic life is now no longer up for debate. If you are no longer interested in me that’s fine – wish you well.”
Send the above and do NOT budge. This guy wants to have his cake and eat it too at the expense of your feelings. Don’t give in.
First of all, you’re not being manipulative.. He told you he doesn’t like labels and that means (since he can’t say it) that you’re not officially together. Which also means you’re free to do whatever you wish, as he is.
Second of all, that also means that you’re not forcing him to do anything, you’re just living your life and he’s salty that you’re not a love-struck puppy for him while he goes around and fucks other people.
Third. HE is the manipulative one.. He’s the one expecting you to stay for him only (with lack of better words) while he can go out and do whatever he wants because you’re not officially together.
Of course this is only one point of outside view and I don’t know everything, but outside of this reason I can’t think of a reason why he would be mad about you going to date other people.
Do you still see something with him after these conversations?
Wowowwww!!! He is so manipulative!
Run! Run! Run! Your first instinct was totally sound.
From this post it seems clear that you are looking for a relationship – he literally said he doesn’t want that so why bother?
He may be great and you could be great together but put yourself first (like he is). You deserve someone that wants you to be your boyfriend and is proud to be taken by you.
I can almost bet money he has a trial of broken hearts around him.
As painful as it may be – save yourself the time & heartache.
Nah this dude sounds toxic not you. Don’t waste your time any more.
He wanted to be able to play the nonchalant cool guy and you crapped on his plans by being willing to step back.
Then he had a nice little freak out about it.
The thing is, if he’s not ready for labels then cool, but you’re not obligated to waste time with someone that’s not on the same page and doesn’t seem similarly invested.
You didn’t do anything manipulative. You just listened to him when he told you he didn’t have feelings for you or want to be your boyfriend. Like, what is he complaining about? The consequences of his actions? Boo hoo.
I see in a comment he told you he’s interested but he’s never had a real relationship before. He’s not a teenager. If he’s still at the point where it’s scary for him to be in a boyfriend/girlfriend relationship, he’s not ready to be with another person. He needs to work on himself so he can be open to being with another person.
If you stay with him it’s going to be this constant cycle – you’ll do a healthy relationship thing, he’ll get scared and try to make you feel bad about yourself for doing it, and then when he sees you’re about to walk away he’ll tell you just enough to prevent you from leaving. Save yourself the trouble. I know you like him a lot, but you’re not in love with him after two months. It’s infatuation and once you get some space you’ll feel better.
So let me summarize the whole story:
After 2 months (which is not “too soon”) you asked him to be exclusive and he said he did not want to be that.
Now he is pissed that you took this rejection in stride and are willing to move on to other potential partners?
Sounds for me like he did want the cake (having you being exclusive to him) and eat it too (be able to sleep around if he chooses to do that)
This was not toxic of you, it was just you moveing on .
Also: Do not become his girlfriend even if he changes his mind. There is more to a relationship than calling you his girlfriend and he seems not to keen to the additional parts.
Manipulative is too strong a word. But be honest with yourself. Do you *really* want to keep seeing this guy on a casual basis? Or is there a part of you that was possibly hoping to hurt his feelings or change his mind with this declaration? Whatever the motivation, I don’t think this action came from a place of backing yourself. If you want to be serious with someone and they don’t want to give you the respect and dignity of a label, don’t waste your time with them. They’re not it. Give yourself some respect and dignity, and find someone who wants the same things as you. Because as amazing as you thought this guy was, he has just proven that he’s not it. Don’t waste time playing games and go find someone who’ll play it straight.
2 months isn’t that “early in” if it’s moving in the direction you both want it to. I think my ex and I knew we were together after the third date. We didn’t have “the talk” other than agreeing to delete the apps.
If you made a mistake anywhere it’s that you said you “understood and respected” when the truth is you didn’t. I don’t understand or respect what he said either. I don’t think anyone else in the thread does. It sounds like what he said was intentionally vague and non-committal, so we can’t be expected to understand it.
I mean, “Define feelings?”. What is anyone supposed to do with that? Is he asking for a thesis on psychology in order for him, at twenty nine, to say whether he likes you and sees things going anywhere? I can get people not liking particular labels, but the terms of a relationship aren’t merely “labels”. “Boyfriend” and “Girlfriend” are labels, but “not sleeping with other people” is a condition he could have expressed if that’s what he wanted.
I know it’s a lot easier to say that now than it is in the moment, but asking for clarity isn’t a bad thing. You can just ask directly “Do you want to be exclusive?”. If they’re still vague then that’s a pretty good sign that you should move on right there.
Anyway, please take that as advice not criticism because I don’t think you were manipulative. Maybe you’re right and it was a little spiteful but ultimately you told him honestly what you wanted and what you were going to do. He couldn’t do the same. That’s on him.
“define feelings” reminds me of the newly-engaged Charles, Prince of Wales’ answer to a journalist asking if he and Diana were in love. While she responded with a starry-eyed “yes!” he said “What is love?”
Pretty sure you know how that ended, but if you don’t you can watch “The Crown” to find out.
Spoiler: it didn’t end well for Diana.
Okay, so the guy has never been in a relationship before, so my thinking is that he just doesn’t understand how shitty and offensive his response truly is. I’m giving him the benefit of the doubt here. You seem to really like him, but I do have a couple of questions for you. Does he have history of just sleeping around? I mean 29 and never been in a relationship is a little odd unless he had not been with many women at all. Next, (I’m not trying to offend you with this) do you have a history of misjudging people? As in, you don’t get a good read on them at first and only after they start being dicks do you realize that they aren’t good people? If this is you, then drop him now and save yourself some time. If you’re generally decent at getting a read on people, then what does your gut say here? Do you feel like he’ll come around after a few more weeks or a couple of months and realize that he is ready to officially label your relationship or will you just be FWB from now until you get tired of it years down the line? If you feel like he’s not playing you, and you really do like him and see a future with him, then my suggestion is to give him a timeline of how long you’re willing to wait before you need a definitive label for the relationship. Don’t call it a deadline or force him into anything, but let him know that you won’t stay around without becoming official.
he’s too old for being like this. dump him if he refuses to be exclusive
>He told me has never been in a relationship before and that is why the “labels” scare him
>He responded by literally saying: “Define feelings..?” and explaining he “does not like labels or this whole boyfriend-girlfriend-thing”
I’m not sure what this guy, at 29, is really expecting to happen.
You’ve made your intentions and feelings clear, he’s not reciprocated this nor is he willing to “label” you as a conventional couple, it seems?
Either you get out of him what on earth it is that he wants or expects out of you both and what he _is_ comfortable with calling you or this just has no future whatsoever.
Maybe he has other issues going on or a history/past that isn’t in the open for us to better understand where he’s coming from, but he can’t go on seeing you as he has been and expect things to not change, when your feelings have.
People who go on about the “no labels” thing but demand/expect the other person to be completely monogamous without actually discussing it with them are toxic.
He wants it both ways, but that’s not how relationships work. I advise you move on, since you’re not on the same page with even being in a relationship.
You want a boyfriend. He did not want to be your boyfriend. You starting to look elsewhere for someone who wants to be your boyfriend is not being manipulative, because he doesnt want that role.
I detested dating people like that when I was single. You want everything that comes with comitment from me, but you dont want to comit and expect me to just wait around and see if you might change your mind at some point, but also might not? No, if we want different things the sensible thing is to go find someone who wants the same.
So he wants you to see him exclusively but doesn’t want the label or commitment that goes with that expectation?
He sounds really immature, insecure, dramatic and manipulative.
At least you learned this fairly early in so you can avoid wasting any more time with him.
Come one.
29y and this lack of maturity is concerning. This isn’t an age where you should be educating someone on how to sustancia a healthy relationship, nor is a time where you should be expectant as to whether someone wants a “label”.
The truth is, that if he doesn’t wanna be your boyfriend, you should move on. Even now, imagine an entire relationship with years of him being this immature.
Firstly , you are certainly not the issue he is.
Something isnt right here . Personally I’m not convinced it’s simply about labels .Even though he may be socially awkward , I think theres more to this .
Im not accusing him of anything I’m just saying that if someone wants more of you , a considerate person would acknowledge the interest and not bite back.
I have a feeling because of what you may feel , you might be a little blinded. I’d be interested in what your besties think
He wants to be exclusive but doesn’t want the label? Wtf?
I think the best thing to do would have been to say hey “I need this (labels and feelings) if you can’t give that to me I’m done here” don’t offer to be friends with benefits. Any guy who can’t handle someone who wants the relationship defined is not the guy to be in a “relationship” with.
Personally, all of these are red flags and I wouldn’t even consider a long term relationship with someone who freaks out like that on me. Imagine other scenarios where you have to have an adult conversation with him and he cant do it. It would be aggravating to me and I feel like there will always be longer fights because of that. There are other guys out there that wont make you feel crazy for how you feel.
Perhaps you can (I mean, if you want!!) give him some leeway in needing time (ie a couple of days, NOT weeks or months) to make a decision whether he wants to pursue an exclusive relationship with you since he’s so new to all of this. But it is totally normal that you expect that this is a stated exclusive relationship that is public, whether you call it bf/gf or partner or SO or main squeeze or whatever. Labels mean things and relationships do not work without communication. Communication = agreement on what things mean. He is being silly if he thinks avoiding labels is avoiding problems. Also, not making things public is a great way to end up miscommunicating to other potential people that you or he are still available.
I feel like I’ve been in his position before, if you like him push him a bit. Since he’s never been in a relationship he might need some hand holding. But if he is too immature and throws tantrums when you try to have serious honest conversations it might be best to move on…
I feel you, it’s a tough pill to swallow when you’re into someone and they’re not feeling the same way. But at the same time, it’s not fair for you to invest all your time and love into someone who isn’t reciprocating. You deserve to be with someone who’s on the same page as you.
As for this dude, it sounds like he’s not really down for a relationship but also doesn’t want you seeing other people. That’s some major mixed signals and it’s not cool for him to call you manipulative or toxic for wanting to have a clear idea of what’s going on. It’s important for people to communicate and be upfront about what they want. If he’s not down for a relationship, that’s fine, but he needs to be honest about that from the start and not get mad when you want to explore other options.
It’s good that you’re being honest and standing up for yourself. It’s not toxic to want to be in a mutual and healthy relationship. And as for the “socially awkward” thing, that’s no excuse for him to be unclear about what he wants.
You do you bro, don’t let this dude drag you down. If he can’t give you the answers and clarity you need, it might be time to move on and find someone who will.
So he doesn’t want to commit but doesn’t want you to move on and find someone who will? I get everyone can have different viewpoints on the types of relationships they have in their lives, but if he doesn’t want what you want, he has no place manipulating you into sticking around to find what you want.
He’s 29 and never been in a relationship and given his reaction to being in one I can see why.
Big world out there. Lots of options for you. How much time do you want to invest in someone who isn’t on the same level as you?
You’re not manipulative. You told him straight up what was going to happen after he told you what was not going to happen.
He can’t have it both ways.
No he’s being manipulative by trying to guilt trip you for being willing to move on.
“Scared of labels” is such a vagina drying phrase.
I guess I don’t understand? He doesn’t like labels, but at the same time you are expected to only be with him and no one else? That is a boyfriend/girlfriend relationship. Its like if I said “I hate tomatoes” and you said but you are eating a tomato right now, and I said “No I hate tomatoes these are what I call red slimy water balls not tomatoes”. He seems weirdly fixated on linguistics.
You: Do you want to commit?
Him: No
You: * *Doesn’t commit* *
Him: * *Surprised Pikachu face* *
If he’s not willing to label you as a couple he shouldn’t be butthurt you want to carry on dating. He sounds manipulate. I would just dump and move on
Lol
Him: “You just need to accept that this relationship will only ever be casual”
You: “Ok, I’ll start dating other people on the side”
Him, all shocked Pikachu face: “No, not like that!”
A relationship is just a long-form interview to see if you want to keep someone in your life.
Tell this guy thanks for applying, but that you’ve decided to go in a different direction.
Based on his response, I’d walk away from the whole package tbh. He’s either playing games or not mature/communicative enough for an adult relationship. Neither bode well for a long term partner.
I would tell him “I’m looking for a serious boyfriend with long term potential. Given your response, our goals don’t align. I have no desire to manipulate/pressure you into something you don’t want or to waste either of our time, therefore this relationship has run it’s course. Goodbye and best wishes”
I was seeing a very similar guy a few years ago, I gave him the benefit of the doubt when he said weird, murky, noncommittal things. I have him that benefit for almost 9 months… and then I decided I had seen enough. I told him that given where our relationship was at and his refusal to discuss commitment, that I wanted to see other people who would take dating more seriously. Some how, in his mind, we were just on the cusp of a committed relationship and I was getting cold feet. I was suddenly the one with “commitment issues” that was “too afraid” to settle down.
It was all very delusional, I thank him for the lesson he gave me in that if you want something you need to be intentional about taking steps towards the life you want. That realization quickly (two weeks post “break up”) led me to an amazing guy who is still a great partner and VERY open about his feelings towards me.
At the end of the day, you aren’t a crazy person for wanting someone who will be committed to you and open with communication of feelings. If he isn’t capable, that’s for him to sort out. You don’t owe him to wait on something that might never come.
This guy sounds very childish to me.
You asked him if he wanted to try a real exclusive relationship and he said no. You gave him the courtesy of letting him know you would continue to date others, and now he’s upset.
He wants you be be exclusive to him without expecting anything of him. His choice also would allow him to be with other people and you wouldn’t be “allowed” to be upset since you are not exclusive. He wants to have his cake and eat it too, and that’s not fair.
I would take a break from this guy. Ironically, he seems pretty manipulative
So I had a similar experience to this. I dated a guy I really fancied. After a couple of weeks we had a chat, I asked where he saw it going next. He gave a long speech about labels being for jars. I went home.
Next time I saw him, I sat him down and said that I’d really enjoyed our time but we’re not compatible romantically and we should be friends. He gets upset, again gives the jar speech and says he doesn’t want to be anyone’s boyfriend. Eventually when he paused his breath, I was like – no one is asking to be my boyfriend dude, this is literally the exact opposite of that conversation.
So I’d draw a line under it if I were you and move on. Don’t have sex with him again, don’t hang out. He is keeping you on the back burner while he looks for someone he really likes. The moment that happens, he will abandon his commitment issues. Don’t be someone’s stop gap option.
I know this sounds harsh, but I wish someone said this to me as a younger woman.
The man is almost 30. Too old for this nonsense.
You were 100% in the right. You’re either his girlfriend or his fuck buddy… there is no I’m between.
He’s emotionally unavailable.
I ignored a similar red flag for several months with an ex. Imagine my elation when he asked me to be official out of the blue. That’s when everything changed.
The whole tone of the relationship was off after that. He just had such an awful fear of commitment. It honestly wouldn’t have worked out anyway, because we had some very strong ideological differences. I initiated the break up bc he was just being grouchy and shitty all the time. Regardless, I was devastated.
Had I distanced myself as soon as he revealed his fear of commitment, id have saved myself so much heartbreak. I’d move on tbh. Good luck!
I dated “this guy” at 29. Don’t do it. Save yourself the time and effort. You seem self assured and confident in what you want and need. Stick to it. Don’t settle.