in Europe there are a few people who have an American parent or ancestor while having almost no contact with the USA, like Marcell Jacobs, are these people seen by the average American as American anyway?
And the various Benedict Arnolds or even worse people, whose name is not even worth mentioning, as they are usually seen?
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Being an American is about citizenship and very little else.
If they were born in America and then immigrated to Europe they will probably still be seen as an American since it is most likely that American English will still be their first language and culturally they will have grown up in the states and so still have some of those habits/behaviors.
I grew up in Germany for example, but I still speak american english primarily and with my american parents culture, so while I can speak German and can relate to them in a lot of ways, I am still an American.
Benedict Arnold was an American but a traitor. Being a traitor doesn’t change the fact that he was an American though. He was born over here and grew up in the colonies.
Being an American has more to do with where you were born and language/gained culture than genetics or blood. Being American (other than being a Native American) is not really an ethnicity, more just a culture.
If your dad/mother or an “ancestor” came from the US but you were born in Germany, lived in Germany, spoke only German, I would not see you as an American. Ethnically you might have some of the hallmarks (being mixed ethnic heritage like the vast majority of Americans), but you are by definition a German, not an American. UNLESS you came back to the states and got a citizenship and lived here. Then you ARE an American.
Being an American is not an outwardly physical list of traits, more so just language and behavior. If you were to line up any list of peoples, dress them the same, and instruct them not to speak, you would not be able to tell which ones were “American” specifically other than some Natives potentially.
I hope that makes sense. Any other Americans can feel free to correct me
I mean those are two different thing. I assure you the millions of people of american descent in Canada are viewed fine.
I don’t think the average American has nothing better to do than to think about random people living in different countries
Well, if you have citizenship, but don’t live here, then that’s fine. We wouldn’t think much of it. Treason is a lot more clear on where we stand with them. No one’s likely to be naming their kid Benedict on this side of the ocean. That being said, there’s a large portion of people who are fine with and celebrate the traitors of 1861.
I don’t think most of us care that much. Living in other countries and playing sports in other countries is not seen as treason.
I have no idea regarding the ancestry of my coworkers. One could be descended from Ben Franklin, one from Jefferson Davis, and one from John Wilkes Booth. I’d never know. Or care for the most part. I once worked with someone who’s father was a war hero from WW2. Someone I’d even heard of. That’s neat I thought to myself, then forgot all about it.
My family is descended in part from someone who was on the Mayflower. We’ve been here since the 1600’s. A good friend’s father emigrated here in 1965. He was just as “American” as me.
I had to google Marcell Jacobs; no idea who he was. By this time tomorrow I’ll have forgotten him. Is he “American?” Wikipedia says he has lived in Italy his whole life and that he considers himself Italian. So I suppose I would call him Italian too.
Tldr; We don’t care.
Those are two very very different questions.
For national traitors, as in those who have actively sought to destroy America or give our enemies top secret information that could be detrimental to America’s security, there is a general dislike which scales with the perceived level of treason.
For those who have immigrated to another country from the US (some like to style them selves as “expats”), idk if there really is all that common of a thought about them. It is uncommon enough that it usually doesn’t even cross people’s minds that most people can do that, or that they would even want to do that. If anything, maybe there may be a perception of moving internationally to be kinda a rich man’s game, especially for those moving to Europe. Probably a major reasoning for this is just how far away a lot of the “desirable” countries are, and how expensive air travel is. But overall it is just so uncommon that I doubt most Americans actually have an opinion on this group of people.
I had never heard of that Marcell Jacobs guy until now. Upon looking him up I have no idea why I’ld view him as a “traitor.” He is American because he was born in the US. Also his father is an American. Seems he was raised in Italy by his mother. He had a unique background for sure but no I don’t view him as a traitor or negatively in any way due to his upbringing or due to competing for Italy in international sports competitions.
As far as Benedict Arnold type people there really aren’t many like him. Various US intelligence personnel who were agents for foreign governments that we know of were executed like the Rosenbergs or are in prison like Robert Hanssen and Aldrich Ames. My thoughts are they got what they deserved for their crimes.
Americans are people with American citizenship. Full stop.
I don’t see “having an American parent” and “is a traitor” as even remotely the same.
“American” isn’t an ethnic group you can be ‘part’ (in the way you can, say, be part Mongolian or Polish) because it’s all about citizenship with us, and you either are a citizen or you aren’t.
That would leave the question of if people feel kinship with someone whose grandmother lived here but had no personal or cultural ties to the US and were themselves 100% born and raised elsewhere.
Generally speaking, Americans would view that guy the same as they would a person from the other society who had no ties to the US. It would be an interesting fact about him, but that’s about it.
Traitors are a whole different thing.
Unlike most European countries, the U.S. is not an ethnostate. The sole factor that determines whether you’re an American or not is if you hold American citizenship.
“American” isn’t really seen as an ethnicity at all, which is why Americans can easily identify as their ancestral ethnicity. There’s no conflict there.
So in turn, a person who has an American ancestor but isn’t of American citizenship or culture wouldn’t be seen as American.
In many ways it might depend on the individual. I’ve seen Americans proudly claim someone like Winston Churchill as “half American,” but that’s unusual. If you had an American parent or grandparent, and you were really into American stuff and felt connected to it, people would probably consider you more American than if, say, your German great grandparents moved to America and then back to Germany with your American-born but culturally and linguistically German grandfather, and you don’t have any knowledge or experience with US culture.
None of these people would be considered “traitors.” I think the hypothetical descendant of a famous traitor like Benedict Arnold would be viewed rather positively, really. He would have a definite connection to American history and a rather interesting family story. It would also help that we’re friendly with Britain now: a Russian-born child of a Cold War era US traitor who worked for the Soviets and who now himself supports the current Russian government would be less well-received.
I am a proud descendant of a traitor. He fought against the British multiple times and was executed by them for treason. Nothing in my family tree makes me prouder than that.
The word “treason” isn’t the pejorative that so many people think it is.
In US history, the largest group of traitors were people like Robert E. Lee, an officer in the US Army, who joined the army of the Confederate States of America, and fought against the US Army in the Civil War. In the former Confederate area, there are even statues to these traitors, although there is a push to remove them.
The largest monument to these traitors is Stone Mountain Georgia:
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stone_Mountain](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stone_Mountain)
Americans who live in another place are not considered traitors and other Americans do not care about them.
Americans are not an ethnic group, if you are born here or gain citizenship later in life you are an American, if not, then you aren’t. That’s as much as anyone cares here.
Being a traitor in the US is a very different thing to emigrating from the US.