For context, my parents are not religious nor have we ever followed any traditional values growing up. I don’t even think my dad asked her parents for permission to marry her or anything. Also my dad passed away a few years ago so that’s why if my bf asked, he’d ask my mom. My bf and I are also not religious or traditional in any way.
So I told my mom that I think we’re getting engaged this year and she said he hasn’t asked her and why not? I said I don’t think he’s going to and I don’t expect him to, we’ve never stuck to traditional values so why would he ask? She said it’s traditional, respectful, and he has to. I don’t agree and I don’t know why she is adamant about it.
Do I make him ask her or just stand my ground and not make him ask? Is there a way to do this that makes everyone happy?
Edit:
Poor choice of words saying “do I make him?” I’m not going to make him do anything he doesn’t want to do.
49 comments
Getting engaged is between you and your partner. You have no obligation to cater to your mom’s wants in this, especially since it’s a gross, outdated practice that relegated women to the low status of chattel, without autonomy. You belong to yourself, not your mother, so you are the only person who needs to be asked.
I used to joke that my dad would require it but any man who asked him would subsequently get a no from me. I think it’s fair to stand your ground here – traditions are fine if you want to do them but you don’t have to. Your mom may react poorly, just restate your boundaries and move on. “Mom, I’ve told you this isn’t a tradition we are comfortable with and if you bring it up again I’m leaving this conversation.”
You could keep the peace by asking him to do it if you both know that’s why and that you don’t actually care. But you don’t have to.
This is such a weird and outdated tradition.
It would be putting on a performance for her, and your engagement is *not about her*.
I’m of two minds on this.
1) what would it hurt to be performative and just ask her? It seems like she wants to be included, it probably has something to do with having lost your dad. The only risk here is will she think she can throw a fit and get her way on other things? Is this how she is about other stuff or only the engagement?
2) you’re adults and you aren’t property of your mother. You can simply say no. Then put her on an information diet until you’re actually engaged. The downside here is she may be kind of sour on the whole thing and cast a shadow on the wedding prep.
Sometimes being right (which you are) and trying to prove that point doesn’t have the most positive possible outcome compared to ceding when it’s fundamentally not a big deal. Like it won’t hurt him or you for him to ask her. But it sounds like it will hurt you and potentially the two of you if you don’t.
The thing is, when and if your boyfriend proposes, he is effectively asking for permission. He’s asking permission from the only person whose opinion matters, *yours*.
Asking your mom wouldn’t really be respectful towards you or your autonomy, so personally I wouldn’t want to marry someone who would feel they had to ask.
Your mom is being ridiculous, and you should tell her as much if she keeps this up.
“Mom, you seem weirdly focused on being involved in my engagement. It’s not what I’d expect from you. Is everything ok?”
Ignore your mother. You aren’t a young bride, you are capable of making your own decisions.
She just wants to feel part of the experience. Tell you what, let her be the first to know after you become engaged. Ask for her input on dress, venue, scheduling (but feel free to treat it all as advice not final-decision making). Pick out an area where you are counting on her to make all the decisions – maybe something like printing the invitations? Consulting on catering menus? The point is to give her an ego lift at a time in her life when she is starting to feel irrelevant.
Especially if this is something you don’t care about then there is no need for your boyfriend to have to do this.
Do what you want but be prepared for repercussions. You can only control your actions, not other people’s reactions especially if you are expecting your mother to find or help you fund your wedding
> Is there a way to do this that makes everyone happy?
No. So do what makes you happy.
Just tell her you aren’t property and the only person who’s permission he needs is yours.
Does he get a dowry from your parents in exchange?
Asking permission from parents always seemed ridiculous to me. Not all traditions need to be followed through! You are not property, you don’t need permission. Your bf is not marrying your mother, he is marrying YOU. Ignore her. If she throws a tantrum then simply don’t invite her to ur wedding. It’s ur day, not hers.
>Is there a way to do this that makes everyone happy?
lol come on, dude, you’re 29, this is a silly question
Stand your ground. Your mom is being unreasonable and it is up to you to be the buffer that protects your fiance from unreasonable family demands, just like you would want him to do for you.
Are you property that belongs to your mom or are you an independent free thinking individual?
Does your mom like to make it all about her all the time?
This is a power play by your mum. If you get your BF to ask your mum’s permission, then it will define your relationship [as a couple] with your mum for years to come. She’ll always think she’s the one who ‘allowed’ it. It’s not a healthy approach.
You are an adult. Your BF is an adult. The only people who have *any say at all* in whether you get engaged or married are the two of you.
The whole ‘asking parents for permission’ thing dates back to a time when marriage was essentially a property transfer from the father to the husband. It’s a relic from a very misogynistic time, and the sooner it gets in the bin, the better.
What drivel.
The only person who needs to give their permission to marry your BF is, drum roll…you.
Asking for a daughter’s ‘hand’ is ridiculously archaic and to what end? Will your mother say no? If she does, will you listen to her? Is she going to pay for the wedding? Your house? Your (future) kids’ education?
‘Traditional and respectful’? Stuff and nonsense. I’m substantially older than you and my FIL (who would have been 105 years old if he were still alive) would have laughed until he’d choked if I had asked him
Tell your mum the 21st century is waiting for her when she’s ready
You stand your ground against your mom and inform her that it’s his choice as he is the one proposing. You have informed him of what her thoughts on the matter are and he can make the decision moving forward but you personally do not care either way.
Yes she will be unhappy and hurt but it’s a boundary you need to enforce now and stand up for yourself and your partner. You can’t make everyone happy, but you can make your partner happy which should be your priority over forcing him to do something he is not comfortable with just to make your mother happy.
Personally, my partner wants to ask my dad. I have informed him I do not care either way, my family does not care either way and it’s his choice what he wants as he is the one proposing.
Are you your mum’s property? Will your husband then own you? It’s absolutely insane that she’s asking for him to do this. You are an adult and you are making the decision who to marry. I wouldn’t even humour her.
Personally I would be pissed if my SO had asked my parents. I know it’s not everyone’s take but I am 100% in control of who I married and (even though my family loves my SO) I didn’t give af if they didn’t like him. He’s a good person and I loved (still do) him. We didn’t need anyone’s permission or approval.
Rant over. Tend to feel strongly about this ha.
Your mom needs to keep her nose out of your business…it starts with her “demanding” he asks your for your hand, soon enough it will be her saying where you should put the dining table or tv set.
My father in law was offended. I didn’t ask him. I frankly did not care. Your engagement is between you and your partner.
No one should be making that guy do anything. It’s his life and he’ll do it when he feels ready. Your mom is being pushy for you to be married because she wants legit grandkids.
It was also traditional to offer a dowry, so I would tell mom… IF mom is willing to toss out some cash, jelwelry, property and some livestock, then SO should put forth the effort to ask. Until mom has committed to being completely traditional, she should maybe back off. I would tell her that.
PS… at your age you should be past trying to get your parents approval. If YOU want this, ask your SO. Other than that it should not matter. Your mom should not be dictating anything about your relationship.
Big lesson to learn in life, there will be many situations in life where you cannot make everyone happy. Get used to it. He does not need to ask her for your hand
No its traditional to ask the father. The mother traditionally wouldn’t get any say. She can’t have it both ways.
I wouldn’t even bring this up with your boyfriend. Tell your mother that you’re an adult and getting engaged isn’t about her. If she’s not willing to respect your decisions at the age of 29, then you need to keep her out of the loop.
How many camels does she want for you?
Why would he need her permission to marry you?
Does she think if she says no you won’t still get married?
This tradition stems from the days when women we’re basically property and didn’t have rights. When women literally couldn’t get married without permission.
It’s actually disrespectful to you to insist on this outdated and sexist tradition.
But if you really want a way around this that will rub it in, why don’t you propose to him… and ask his parent’s permission first?
My favorite take on this outdated and sexist tradition:
https://youtu.be/a0qaIvb3bGA
If you think you have the right to “make” him do anything, you are not ready for marriage.
This sounds like your mother feels like she does not know him well enough and that she would profit by a serious conversation with him. If you don’t see a future where the three of you have a healthy relationship, ignore her comments. She is trying to give you her love and support in a way that she understands. You all are having a failure to communicate.
I didn’t ask my wife’s parents for permission because that would have been a sign of respect. I don’t want them to get the wrong idea and think that I have any at all for them, or that I care at all about their worthless opinions.
So when we told them we were engaged and eloping to have our dream wedding, they were just SOL.
I should say that my respect for her parents dwindled over time because i watched them deliberately make choices to make her life worse out of spite, including things like deliberately causing her illnesses, never allowing her to be on the health insurance she was entitled to, turning down money she was entitled to because they didn’t like the source, and more. They never felt they did anything wrong by doing so.
I am not disrespectful to them directly, I am polite when I have to deal with them. But I’m not going to show more than common courtesy.
As a halfway, he could TELL her he’s going to, if he wants and to forge the long term connection. My dad is definitely the type of person who would HATE someone asking his permission to marry me, for the reasons everyone is staying here that I’m not his property.
But, it is a changing family dynamic, and my husband told my father he was going to do it. My mom had also passed away before this happened and I think it made my husband and dad closer. So maybe to forge a bond with your mom he can let her in on the secret. But your fiancé certainly doesn’t have to nor should be expected to ask permission.
The tradition of asking the father for the hand in marriage started because women were considered property, and a deal had to be made between the suitors and fathers. It had nothing to do with respect or even religion.
Ask your mother if she thinks you are her property that needs to be bartered over.
You are almost 30. Do you have agency? Or do you need your mother’s permission to make life decisions?
Tell you mother that the only person he should be asking is YOU because you are an adult capable of making your own decisions.
If she can’t live with that, she doesn’t have to attend the wedding.
Did you ask her what your dowry was going to be? If she’s planning on gifting a house for you two to begin your married life in?
A dowry is as outdated as asking. But if I was getting a dowry also an outdated tradition, hell I might suck it up and ask. Hell yeah why not.
So in summary I’d ask Mom has she thought about what the dowry is. And she says no. I’ll be very careful to listen to how she answers. BOOM. She just explained why he isn’t asking.
Edit to add: by old fashioned standards, watch sense and sensibility. You said you’re 29, you’re an old maid. At 29 the parents will say YES to literally anyone who still has a pulse. Do you see how ridiculous it is to follow some of the old ways of thinking?
Your question – *do I MAKE him?* – is revealing. Why wouldn’t you explain the whole business to him, both from your POV and from Mom’s, and decide together how best to handle it? Or is marriage entirely the bride’s business, and the groom just an accessory?
Lol bro to many cooks in the kitchen already
I told my parents that if a partner ever asked them before proposing to me, it would be an automatic no from me.
I told my fiancé when we first got serious that if I ever found out he’d asked my father for permission to marry me like I’m some man’s property, the relationship would be over. And I told my dad the same thing and he supported me. Ask your mom why she thinks she’s entitled to a say
I was the opposite. I asked my husband, who proposed without asking for my parents’ blessing first, and I requested that we hold off announcing until he did. He was the one with the “it’s a sexist, out-dated tradition”. He was really surprised that I wanted him to ask first.
To me, it had nothing to do with permission. Neither my dad nor my mom, who adored my then boyfriend, were ever going to say anything even hinting that they were against us getting married. And even if they did, there was no world where that would have stopped me from marrying him. My parents knew that. It’s how they raised me. I never let sexism stop me from experiencing something happy and I wasn’t going to start now.
It was a sign of respect I think – an acknowledgment that my parents (& sister) were my core people, my nuclear family, and that my parents were my “call in case of emergency” people and assumed that role with love, joy, and a strong sense of responsibility. My husband was going to take over that role, my new “call in case of emergency” contact. Almost like, “I’ll love her as my person – like you did” nod.
Yes, it’s sexist and the original “asks” were horribly based on notions of women being property. But my husband, who happened to be the man in this situation, was the one proposing. And honestly, I expected him to be the one to propose. That’s another tradition based on misguided gender roles. But actions can be meaningful and poignant regardless of their etiology. They meant something to me, and it therefore meant something to my husband. They’re our traditions now.
My mom did warn my husband that I could be difficult sometimes and required some patience. I never let her live that down. ❤️
I told my husband not to ask my dad, and he ended up just having a conversation with him where he was like, I’m asking your daughter to marry me and I’d like your blessing, but really I’m just letting you know.
Worked for me. I’m not property.
You may be creating an argument when you don’t need to, i wouldn’t look at it as him “having to ask her” but as him doing something out of convention, she’s hardly going to say “no”, its just a bit of a tradition or idea she has in her head.
20 odd years ago, my wife and i decided to get married, and you know what, part of me regrets not asking her dad, just in a kind of cool nod to the fact that he has looked after her over the years, and he’s close, she never suggested it and i never asked, but i’d say it would have made his day and possibly year. Instead, as he was handing her over at the top of the church, i said thanks, and i’ll look after her for him. He nearly drowned in tears on his way back to his seat after that.
it doesn’t mean anything to you or your partner, but people of an age, don’t get to domthat kind of stuff anymore, it doesn’t mean anything, but its a nice touch,
first off, there is no universal standard. Lots of local custom and personal preferences are at play. While many positions are defendable, I don’t think any are inherintly right or wrong.
While I agree with you that it is not required and your relationship is between you and your partner, consider the cost vs. benefit. It literally does not cost anything to have a conversation. It may be a bit awkward, but hey, engaged life is when you should have awkward conversations. The more you two are able to communicate and problem solve together, the easier marriage will be. And for many, marriage is about welcoming each other to your respective families and becoming one new family, blending both. It can therefore be important to find ways to respect and incorporate both sides, even if it isn’t necessarily what you envision.
I also think many parents not only see it as a sign of respect, but that of trust. Most parents don’t want to be completely surprised. Many people want to celebrate their engagement with their parents pretty soon after. I know plenty of friends who got engaged and we all went for drinks, often with parents, within a few days.
I know when I asked my wife to marry me, I spoke to her parents and her brother ahead of time and told them my plans. Their love and support made me feel even better about doing it. Again, it was less about true “permission” and more about showing them trust and respect.
One middle ground to consider, is not to ask for permission, but to have him inform her of his plans at an appropriate time.
As for those saying your mother will meddle int he relationship forever – only you know if that is true. In fact, not asking her when she has made it clear this is important to her, may cause worse negative meddling as she may be insulted and never forgive. We just don’t know enough to predict her behavior.
The real question for you is what do you gain or lose in either scenario, and can you and your boyfriend effectively work as a team to solve a challenge together. Not everyone will ever be 100% happy, but you can find a way to balance and avoid anyone being too upset. This certainly won’t be last thing you ask your boyfriend to do for you for family, and while strange to him, he should be concerned about starting marriage by knowingly insulting his mother in law. But you are both well within your rights to stand firm and be justified in doing so. As a therapist once told me – “Sometimes you can be right or you can be married. Pick and choose the hills you want to die on and the prize you want to win” a 2 minute phone call, in my opinion, is worth the prize.
I think a way to reframe this is he asks for her blessing, NOT her permission. And whether she gives her blessing or not, he’s still proposing to you.
As someone who is religious and maybe a little old fashioned, this is a dumb tradition and I did not do it with my then GF, now wife of 19 years.
He has not asked you yet..back off and let him do things his way. That decision is not yours or moms to make, it’s his. Butt out.
You are not her property to give away. Her expectation is ridiculous. Some traditions deserve to die, and this is one of them. (And it’s mostly dead anyway — I’ve never known anyone in my whole life who did this before getting engaged).
Tell her that if she continues to insist on this, you’ll just elope and let her know after the deed is done. Her choice.
My mom tried this shit with me. I told her I wouldn’t marry anyone who asked for permission.