If you look at the askwomenover30 sub it’s full of hourly questions looking for validation and support for women who haven’t kids by 40. I realise I’ve yet to see a single question like that in askmenover30.
I’m curious if anyone has thoughts on this. I can speculate it’s because we can have kids at anytime as long as our sperm are viable, but I’m curious if there’s more to it or not. Are men not biological driven to want kids in the same way? The same desperation doesn’t seem to be present here. It’s mostly moaning about lack of sex or intimacy
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The biological compulsion for children was never in me. The cultural compulsion was there but the wife and I are still childless. We wonder how getting old will look as we start to handle our own parents.
There is a term called geriatric pregnancy but no make equivalent. I’d guess that women face pressure of knowing they have window of time to have kids in a way men don’t.
I’m gay so having kids is a bit more of a hassle, but also I just don’t think I ever want kids. I finally have a good job, I’m trying to get out of debt and save for retirement, and the last thing I need is some parasite taking everything I have. Lol. Not to mention the planet is already overpopulated.
haha, i’m that guy, mostly because i’d wanted kids about ready to GTFO by the time i was 55 so i could save for retirement and travel at that point. i never post about it because we do have the luxury of time, even if its not the ideal case. in comparison with allllllllllll the other issues folks have, this is inconsequential. lastly, noone cares
It’s such a complex issue for guys. I think there’s competing pressure to be financially successful, find a good partner and then have children. Also the time pressure isn’t the same on men as women so it’s just one of the pressures, not the main one.
Yeah, because everyone here is asking what to do about their depression, unfulfilling life and loneliness hourly
Women have just been conditioned to have a timeframe for having children and a lot were raised in an environment where having a family was their life’s purpose. A number of the men’s questions here develope from a similar vein I imagine. How to maximize earning potential, how do I be less lonely, how do I date etc.
Well, biologically as well as society standards.
Men’s bodies don’t have to be strong to do their part in producing a child, women’s do. Men just have to be able to pump the seed while women’s eggs lose quality with age.
I don’t want this comment to come off as some way of me determining their value by reproduction but when they are looking to have children a doctor will tell you that their bodies are less primed for it as they get older.
I don’t think there’s as much pressure on men to have kids as there is towards women.
I think biologically, women get an urge to have babies. I have two and feel mentally done with it, but also, I really want another baby – there’s not really any logical reason I would want another baby.
Also, I can’t speak to never having children. I got pregnant at 28 and only a few weeks earlier, I said to myself “I think I want a baby”, but it was less intense than it is now at 34. The pregnancy, carrying the baby for 9 months, feeling it move inside of you, meeting it for the first time. It’s a painful and uncomfortable experience physically, but it’s also kind of addicting as well.
I am guessing this urge never totally goes away, but we get too tired and old to have more babies, which is why we all can’t wait to be grandmas.
I like the discussions on AskMenOver30 more than the equivalent women’s subreddit. 🤷🏼♀️
I would never want to bring a child into this world with the way everything is going. So I tend not to worry about it.
This sub tends to be full of career/jobs related questions though for some reason
Those of us that do, are actually working towards and preparing ourselves for that instead of whining because we wasted our young years sleeping around.
The idea of “childfree” life seems very popular on reddit as a whole.
On a very over simplified basic level.. men are interested in women, women are interested in babies.
Women have a much stronger instinct to produce and nurture off spring than men.
Men can quite easily find fulfilment in their work, hobbies, adventure. To the point where they’re much more ready to put their life at risk for such things, which is probably a reflection on days gone by where men were the fighters, hunters, builders, where their lives were more expendable than women’s.. on the whole, you’re not going to take as much risk if you’re driven by wanted to nurture children, as opposed the excitement of taking on a mammoth or defending your tribe/family from an invading force.
Men and women have different purposes and as such have different drives… as much as we’re hammered into thinking this isn’t the case.
No point reproducing, no house, no money, no future. It’s bleak. Why bother with a relationship if you don’t have money. Kids are a huge responsibility, and if you cannot provide them with a comfortable life then don’t bother.
Women are brainwashed by their mothers, grannies, aunts and friends from small to produce babies the moment they have a ring on their finger – not to mention by society at large; they therefore think it’s their raison d’etre
Despite what Reddit will have you believe. Men and women do not have the same age/fertility issues.
Men until they day they die can get a women pregnant. Women all stop ovulating around age 40-50. And unless you have the money to store eggs and do IVF which has a higher failure rate the older you are… you are screwed. Plus the risk and ability for women over 30 to have a child drop each year by a large percentage based on data.
Plus if you look at the data on attraction. Men are attracted to younger women and women are attracted to slightly older men.
>The same desperation doesn’t seem to be present here.
Because there’s no “hard limit” for men re kids and age. I’d also theorise based wholly on anecdotal evidence that while of course some men are keen on kids in the abstract, quite a few men I know, me included, tend(ed) to think about a relationship first, then factor kids into that. As in **very** broadly speaking I think it’s more likely that a woman will think “I want a partner and kids, so I’ll find a partner who wants kids”, whereas men might lean more towards “I want a partner, and will think about kids later / will discuss it with my partner in due course”.
Before getting married/having kids the idea of specifically having a family just wasn’t high up my priority list – I was thinking more about finding the right person. I *think* if I’d met someone awesome who didn’t want kids, I’d have been fine with that. My wife definitely did want kids, and we met mid 30s so we couldn’t hang around *too* long, so had that conversation relatively early on and I decided to come down off the fence. We’ve got two lovely kids and no regrets for the path we chose.
Edit: I think also, sperm aside, a lot of men (again, me included) don’t/didn’t fully appreciate how exhausting kids are. I’m now in my 40s with a 5 and 2 year old and I’m *tired*, in a way I don’t think I would be without them. From about 7am-8pm there’s almost always something to handle, or the next thing is coming up, or there’s drama, or whatever. Constant running narrative in my head of what needs doing, organising, thinking about, let alone simply chasing after them. I was pretty fit from about 25-39, but now exercise doesn’t really happen, no time/energy/inclination for it. But I’m hoping my earlier efforts stood me in good stead. I’m hardly decrepit now, but I can see how being in this position but 10 years younger would be a lot easier. So some men may well think “I can have kids in my 50s and beyond” without really thinking about the reality of having young kids in later years. Friend of mine is over 50 with kids only slightly older than mine and he struggles.
I have a 12 year old and no desire to have another kid. Simple enough
I can’t think of a situation in my life where the presence of children would improve things. I do love children – it’s just such an irreversible decision and you can’t know what’s on the other side.
I imagine women get a lot of messaging about having children. There is a time limit that’s more present for them. And yeah – a (major) biologically driven desire. I don’t think having kids makes you magically fulfilled – nothing will do that. There’s so much else to talk about (and listen about).
Edit – on a ferry writing this. Pulling in and all the kids collectively lost their minds. I can’t image. And now it’s quiet. I like quiet.
From what I gathered from my friends 90% don’t care about kids. Their partner always wants one and they eye roll and go with it. Most of them make great fathers don’t get me wrong but very few actually cared prior. I don’t want any though. But I see it with guys in work too. Maybe some pretend not to care but actually do but that seems to be the general vibe here.
Because I don’t care. I’m struggling as it is, nevermind putting extra pressure on myself. I could live 1000 different lives and be happy. I’m content with just doing my best and trying to be happy with the cards I’m dealt. I find peace in not caring about things I have no control over.
I’m 30 now and would like to have a kid in the next 5-10 years probably. I typically date in the 23-28 range. I feel like I have plenty time. Women don’t usually date younger, and pregnancy gets complicated past early 30s. Different time pressure.
I’ve seen several posts here in the last few months from guys worried about settling down and having kids before they get too old. I think there is more of a focus/worry on finding the relationship that could make having kids a reasonable option, rather than having the kids in time, but I think a lot of guys are concerned by the idea of being an old parent.
I like my jam in the jam jar not all over the fucking house!
My wife got pregnant on or about my 35th birthday. I can guarantee that if it didn’t happen by the time I was 40 I’d be super worried and sad about it.
Lol because you can still make children until you’re 90
I had kids starting WAAAAY too young, but even so, me can become fathers at any time in their entire lives as long as they’re healthy for their age. For men, the only determiner of whether we have children is the age of our partner.
So it’s not a stressor for us as far as “feeling complete” in its own right because, unlike women, age alone does not force an arbitrary deadline on us.
I have a newborn at 39, plan on having another too.
My wife is 33
What’s the rush? I wanted to enjoy my life and get financially secure before I got in a serious relationship and had kids. Something to keep me going when I get old. At 39 now I love hanging with my pops.
I think, like dogs and cats, having kids made more practical sense 50+ years ago.
– people are less religious now, so “be fruitful and many” feels like less of a divine obligation to fulfill
– most people work for corporations/other people, and therefore don’t have significant capital/businesses to pass on to their children
– most people live in apartments/townhomes/condos/houses on relatively small lots, so there’s no need to have children to help steward farmland/acres of land. If anything, kids take up more space in already-small dwellings
– peerages/patrilineal societies are less relevant these days, so you don’t need to purposefully have a son or daughter to form an economic/political alliance with a specific kingdom or social classes
– the idealized and romanticized nuclear family as portrayed on “Leave it to Beaver” doesn’t exist
– the rates divorce and estrangement are high and only growing, meaning the statistical likelihood of having an idyllic “Leave it to Beaver”-like loving nuclear family is only declining
– the aforementioned high divorce and estrangement rates means that the parents themselves are less likely to have close relationships with their own parents/extended family, making childcare the sole responsibility of parents or paid babysitters/day care facilities that can eat up most of a middle class adult’s monthly wages
– couples mostly fight about money and childcare, and having children is the most expensive activity that many people engage in, meaning that marital discord is more likely to occur
– educational/credential inflation is rapidly turning a bachelors degree into the new high school diploma, and rising higher education costs means that parents must financially support their kids for 4-5 years after high school so they can get a BA, and an additional 2-3 years for an MA
– “stranger danger” and helicopter parenting means that parents are now responsible for shuttling their kids to and from various scheduled and costly extracurricular activities, rather than just turning their kids loose on evenings and weekends to play with other neighborhood kids until it gets dark
– chronic illness, sickness, mental illness, and neurological conditions are more common amongst Gen Z and younger, meaning that the cost/time of managing the increasingly complex and costly medical, mental health, and emotional needs of children must be considered
– “chosen family” amongst adults who have mutually chosen to form supportive relationships with one another provides more meaningful fulfillment when compared to spending 18-25+ years of providing physical/financial/emotional support for children who you may not even have a decent relationship with as an adult
– overcorrection for absentee parenting means many parents feel pressured to give up friendships/family/hobbies/personal growth all in service to kids with whom may not even maintain a good adult relationship, meaning it was essentially all for nothing, leading to “empty nest syndrome” and midlife crises
– sociological and [psychological](https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S2405661819300176#bb0275) research shows that many people have kids as a way to signal adulthood or attempt to find meaning in one’s life. There are plenty of less costly and more value-adding ways to display adult traits or achieve existential fulfillment. Similar to how the common adage of PhDs is to avoid pursuing them unless absolutely necessary, people who “want kids” might be better served by pursuing careers that provide service to children, or explore other forms of caregiving.
Women have a biological clock, and men don’t. Simple as.