So my (29f) fiance(31m) has 3 sisters, the one I will he talking about today is Nancy. Nancy has a daughter (Sally, 4f) who is extremely spoiled. Like you tell this kid no, she will start bawling, crying, throw herself to the floor. Just full on tantrum. Then when she gets what she wants she goes back to normal and will get upset of you are upset at her for throwing a tantrum.
Now I have been planning a mini vacation to Disney world with my kid sister (12f) and nephew (9m) for months now. I have a well paying career in the medical field and wanted to take them since they’ve never been. The rooms are booked with them sharing a room but having their own seperate beds, with me and my fiance in the room right next to them. We are scheduled to leave in a week.
Today, my MIL and Nancy sit me down to say how it isnt fair that Sally isnt going to Disney World with her aunt and cousin in law. How she shouldnt miss out on the experience. I tell her (in order to avoid a fight) that maybe next time as everything has been booked without a way to add anyone. I also add that my nephew and sister are still young but at the age I dont have to hold their hand to eat, use the bathroom, shower, etc.
My MIL then says “family sacrifices for family”. At that point I see that they’ve already made up their mind that theyre going to try to force/guilt us to bring Sally. So then I reply saying that if Sally is going to come then fiance will have to book her tickets, stay with her in her room (the rooms I booked are the resort, disney character rooms), and be the one to take care of her.
MIL immediately argued against it saying that he doesnt know how to take care of young kids. That since I was joining the family I should want to bring Sally.
I told her its a vacation, why would I bring a child that’s notoriously known for misbehaving, throwing tantrums, and breaking down when told no?
Nancy started yelling at me that her child is well behaved, that they cant afford to take her so its our responsibility.
I then told MIL and Nancy that the whole point of me and fiance being DINKs (dual income no kids) is that we can spend our time and money however we want or dont want to.
After some more arguing they left. When fiance got back from work we talked about what his sister and MIL said. Fiance told me that he wouldnt even take Sally if they threatened to disown him. He said that she is too much for him to handle and that Nancy even talks to him about how much she regrets having Sally. And thats on top of the price of tickets and the fact that it will be a week out of state and essentially across the country.
I need advice on if that was the best way to handle it and if there id anyway we can make it up to Sally but on a less extravagant way. Sally was not there for the discussion. I do feel bad for Sally as its very visible that nobody (adult or kid) really wants to be around her due to her behavior. I dont want to take her because I want to enjoy my time and I know for a fact that will not happen with Sally there.
TLDR:
SIL and MIL tried to bully me into taking SILs daughter to Disney World. The daughter is poorly behaved where not even her mom wants to be by her.
32 comments
I don’t think you handled it terribly, considering they ambushed you with this. Although I do think a better response would have been to just say “I’ll have to talk to fiance about this as it’s not my decision to make alone.” Or just asked them why they were bringing this to you, rather than him, (probably because they knew what his answer would be and were hoping you’d fold to “keep the peace.”)
Also, I think your in-laws don’t understand that there’s a difference between blood relations that you’ve known all their lives vs. extended family that you marry into. Especially one that you haven’t even married into yet. They shouldn’t be coming directly to you for anything (unless it’s something like “we want you to help us with fiance’s surprise party”.) They should go to him, or to both of you together.
Why would you want to ruin your own trip? Bad behavior should not be rewarded, you’re fully in the right for not taking her. Maybe Nancy should work on making sure this behavior is nipped before Sally gets much older.
Personally I’d just ignore sil and mil. They can make demands til the cows come home, but at the end of the day they’re not the ones paying for Sally to go. They’re not the ones dealing with Sallys tantrums. Your trip was not intended for Sally to go. Sil has some mighty nerve to insist you pay for her daughter to attend a trip that she wasn’t invited to.
> I need advice on if that was the best way to handle it
Well, no.
You could have just said “no,” but instead you tried to explain and excuse and give them the chance of having a discussion, which you knew would be just a guilt trip.
Alternatively, you could’ve said “Probably not, but I’ll think about it.” And refuse to elaborate.
These people seem to be experts in trying to wiggle if you give them any room, so remember; don’t JADE — justify argue defend explain. They don’t actually care about your opinion or well-being, they just have something they want and will just use your words against you.
>and if there id anyway we can make it up to Sally but on a less extravagant way.
Sure, you can offer a day trip, to a kids’ amusement park or something. Or a zoo or an aquarium.
A 5-year-old shouldn’t be making long trips without their parents anyway.
Just say no, end of discussion.
I love your shiny spine. NTA
I expect in ten years time that child will hit puberty and all hell is going to break loose.
Sally doesn’t sound like the only one who is spoiled here. Let your fiance take care of this as it sounds like he agrees with you and they are his family. This is the time for him to step up and defend you.
> Nancy even talks to him about how much she regrets having Sally.
This may be one of the saddest statements I’ve read. Put some money that a decent portion of the niece acting out is from feeling neglected. The rest is because her parents do neglect her emotional well being by not setting rules and consequences.
That being said, it’s not fair to the 9 and 12 year old to take any 4 year old.
For the future – You need to extricate yourself from these ambushes the second you realize what’s going on. Conversations like this need to happen in front of your fiance, with him taking point.
Also, do not justify your decisions. People like this are willing to argue with a blank wall in an empty building. They ask you to take niece somewhere, the answer is “Sorry, no, I can’t.” Do not answer questions as to why or explain any further. “As I already said, I cannot.” And then leave or turn the conversation to some other topic, if you can’t bail.
You have to teach other people what you will tolerate. They’ve already shown they are willing to go around your partner, ambush you, try to manipulate you and and yell at you. This will not be the last of their shitty behavior if you give them even the faintest inkling of hope.
“that won’t work for us”
No other explanation should be given. Reasonable people get explanations, people like this do not because they will just take it as a starting point for the argument.
>Nancy even talks to him about how much she regrets having Sally
Awkwardness of the situation aside (you are NTA, kiddos coming on vacation is a privilege, not a right), I think I have identified why Sally may be having those massive, insane tantrums.
It can be a discipline problem, but acting out like that is also common when a child feels unloved and does not get attention from their primary caregiver, so they act out insanely to try and get attention – any attention – from someone to show they care. There’s overlap with the lack of discipline (if Nancy doesn’t care enough to discipline, oooof) , but I feel sorry for Sally.
There is a reason it’s called the Fucking Fours (alongside the epithets of “terrible twos” and “threenager”) in a lot of parenting groups, but it could also be signs of neurodivergency.
Honestly, even if Sally were well behaved, as you pointed out, she is much younger than the other children. It’s not practical to bring her.
As far as her behavior- it seems clear where she gets it from. It’s a shame as she’s only 4. Her mother is not setting her up for good mental health or for having good relationships. It’s very very sad. But taking her on this trip will not fix these problems. I’d feel bad for her and try to visit with her another time. If in the future this trip is talked about I would frame it to her as she was too young to attend.
hahahahahaha the audacity to expect YOU to pay airfare, transportation, accommodation, food, entertainment for the pleasure of babysitting a hellion of a poorly-raised child.
I would distance myself from the inlaws and shut down the info train so they don’t know your plans until after the fact. Maybe you should take up your fiancé on the offer to disown his FOO. And make damn sure the two of you are not appointed as Sally’s guardians should anything happen to Nancy.
Do nothing.
Stop taking MIL and SIL calls if they will behave this way. Don’t bring up Sally’s behaviour again. It’s not a kind argument and you don’t need it. She’s 4. She’s too young for the trip this time. This is for the slightly older children who do not require as much caretaking. A four-year-old is simply not in the plan this time.
In the future, NEVER let these two women corner you into a conversation without your husband present. I’d strongly encourage you to create a boundary where you are never present with them at all, unless your fiance is too. Smile, and repeat as needed “Fiance needs to be part of this conversion. We can book a time to talk.” Don’t be baited into any conversation whatsoever. Say nothing, unless he is present. Don’t let them bully you and then blame you. Make your husband deal with their shit. Never, ever again give them this opportunity to use you two against one another.
You really, *really* need to not take this sort of bait again, and let these things turns into debates. They successfully spun you right up and got you to say unproductive and unkind things that were totally needless. You got down to their level and that foolish of you. There was no debate here to have, no discussion you needed to be a part of. You need to learn to smile and leave.
Unfortunately, you can’t fix this for Sally. Bad parenting is going to do its damage. Continue to treat Sally as you always would with appropriate gifts and treats for your relationship and her age. Disney with a 12 and 9 year old is not appropriate for her age. Not kind to her, or to the older children.
This is a big kid trip. And when Sally is a big kid, maybe she’ll get her big kid trip to Disney. Four is really young to go to Disney without a parent present. We say every single person on a Disney trip gets one meltdown, because everyone loses their mind at Disney. I can’t imagine taking a kid who REGULARLY melts down.
I would suggest to the grandma and Nancy that you would be remiss if you took away their opportunity to give little Sally her first Disney experience. She is too young to stay in a hotel room by herself, and too young to ride the big kid rides. So no, no you cannot take little Sally.
I agree not taking Sally is the only realistic option. She sounds feral. And I’m pretty sure this little tidbit isn’t helping Sally at all, either:
>*He said that she is too much for him to handle and* ***that Nancy even talks to him about how much she regrets having Sally.***
Where is Sally’s father in all of this? Because a kid, even at 4 years old will know it isn’t wanted. I am not a child psychiatrist, let alone a medical professional. But that kid needs help, one way or the other. And that other may involve a visit by CPS if nothing else works.
If Nancy is saying this to your husband, her brother, she’s saying this to friends and other family. The kid knows. The kid deserves better.
Do not make it up to Sally.
“We had such a good time. It won’t be the last time we go. If you can listen to mommy and show us that you can be a big girl who is ready for these trips then maybe you can come the next time”.
Bingo. Now mom can make the eyes and go “Disney land” when she starts up lol.
But when you hear the guilt trips from adults? The whole family sacrifices for family thing?
“I agree! I look forward to Sally growing into a responsible and polite child that we will all really enjoy spending time with”
Damn they had an ambush planned. They also probably earmarked your earnings for future vacations, presents, other events btw.
Don’t go down the road of defending your choice. Your can’t argue with unreasonable people. The fact they asked/demanded in the first place is just so unbelievably rude and out of line.
No matter what you say, they will argue it to death. So just shrug your shoulders and say no.
**If they keep pressing, tell them that them bothering you is making you feel less inclined to ever do anything nice for your Niece going forward in the future if they keep this up.**
Basically leverage your advantage in this situation. They can either behave and have a Aunt and Uncle in the Nieces life that can afford to get her nice things every once in a while. (if she learns to behave) Or they can alienate you both and have their niece lose out on all future experiences and gifts.
NTA- how tacky to come to you and even ask. I think you handled it without being the AH but your SIL and MIL are. You’re not responsible for your fiancé niece and she’s too young to really enjoy Disney like the older children. I remember taking my three children and my youngest daughter was around 5 and she was cranky after a few hours. I had to take her back to the room while my husband got to enjoy the rest of the day with the older children. Don’t feel bad. Maybe Sally will grow out of this monster stage and you’ll want to take her when she’s older.
Why do you need to make it up to Sally? You are being way too generous in this scenario.
And as a bit of advice, I was brought to Disney at 4 or 5 and legitimately my only memory is playing Pokemon with my cousin on the flight down. My parents brought me again when I was 9 with a friend and my mom is on record saying she loved going when I was young but it was such a waste of money.
Sally is 4 – she’s not going to remember anything about this, you do not need to make it up to her. There’s truly no reason to take her, even if she wasn’t a nightmare. She’s barely going to remember it and 4yo generally do not have the stamina that a 9 and 12yo have for standing in lines and being on their feet all day, for several days, in the sun. So even aside from her being a brat, any 4 year old would completely change the type of vacation you’re able to have. Stand your ground, you have nothing to feel guilty about. They’re being unreasonable.
Edit to add: she’s probably also not tall enough for the non-kiddy rides and so would be missing out constantly, one of you would always be having to wait with her, and we know how well she handles being told no!
“Family sacrifices for family.”
Your own sister isn’t family to your boyfriend’s sister’s kid.
Sally is 4. She doesn’t have to know about her uncle and his fiancee and that fiancée’s relatives’ vacations. Who is rubbing that in poor Sally’s face?
Listen. Your MIL and SIL are bullies. I came to speak to you without your husband being there because they knew that the answer would be no from him.
In fact, your husband confirmed this by saying that his own sister told him that she regrets having her child.
This is your husband circus and they are his monkeys. He needs to put them back into their lanes ASAP. This should include a yelling from him that if they ever try to pull this shit with his wife again that he will disown them!
This is the only way to move forward. Otherwise they will continue to try to pull this shit with you.
Just a suggestion- you might want to stay elsewhere the night before you leave, or leave earlier. There have been other posters in your situation who were ambushed at the last moment with a kid packed up and excited for a trip their parents hyped them up for, thinking the op couldn’t possibly say no then.
You handled it great in my opinion! You stood your ground despite their manipulation and bullying attempts.
>if there id anyway we can make it up to Sally
No. Don’t do anything to try and ease your guilt towards Sally. Sally needs to learn that the world doesn’t revolve around her and that sometimes life isn’t fair. She will never learn that if everyone around her constantly enables her.
I’ve taken my daughter to Disney World for her 4th birthday and again with cousins at age 10. They were two completely different trips; different rides, interests, and activities. Y’all will not be happy hanging out in the tot lots, and Sally will freak out waiting an hour while they do the big kid rides. Or you and BF separate to divide and conquer. It will ruin your lovely trip. NTA.
I’m sure you’re of the mindset to stay firm, so I would just say something along the lines of, “Again, everything has already been planned and book. You and the rest of the family knew well in advance of our plans. It will already be a handful watching 2 kids, so my bandwidth will already be stretched quite thin. Should another opportunity arise and Sally is more mature and independent, we can evalute at that time.”
I’m always of the mind to be tactful. Don’t give into emotions. Stay firm and calm. And should they bring family sacrifices for family, I would retort(I’m sassy so I love putting people’s words back in their mouths), unfortunately family will have to sacrifice for family, and Sally will have to sit this one out so I can provide a good vacation for (sister) and (nephew). Perhaps, next time, Nancy can take all 3 kids somewhere nice.
Let’s see how Nancy reacts to that.
Not sure what there is to argue, she’s too young and you will already have 2 children to watch over. If they want her to go so badly, one of them can hop a plane and meet you there with Sally. It’s also beyond ridiculous and entitled for them to expect you to fit the bill.
Leave aside everything else.
Asking anyone, let alone people who have never cared for a toddler, to take a 4 y/o on a trip without their parents is absolutely bonkers to me.
It’s bad (for you) that you mentioned Sally’s behaviour as a reason, but may potentially end up being good for her parents to hear saidnout loud.
I can’t shake that dynamic where they just wouldn’t take no for an answer. Are they truly just so unabashedly narcissistic, or are they used to people pussyfooting around their demands? Those two options aren’t mutually exclusive.
This is a problem for your fiancé to solve with his sister and mother; to convey the message that you’re not taking Sally, and that in other circumstances he’d love to discuss the reasons, but that theyve proven to be completely unreasonable and he just doesn’t feel like giving a reason. It’s your time and your money, and you just won’t.
And let the chips fall where they may. If they decide to cut contact over this, then it just wasn’t a good relationship to begin with.
It’s refreshing to see:
(A) Someone standing up for themselves when pressured by in-laws.
but more importantly
(B) the poster’s partner 100% having their back and standing up to their own family.
Well done, OP. Now we know where your niece gets her sense of entitlement from: her mother and grandmother!
NTA